[20:14:06] ToryLynn Writer: back to chapter 3…..
[20:14:17] ToryLynn Writer: I was reviewing the beginning conversation
[20:14:31] ToryLynn Writer: these men don’t seem like they’ve done any real WORK in thier entire lives
[20:14:49] Dagny Franciosa: which men is that referring to?
[20:14:55] Ina Centaur: lol
[20:14:56] ToryLynn Writer: Taggart inherited, Boyle got $2m fron the government…
[20:15:04] Dagny Franciosa: true
[20:15:08] Ina Centaur: here we go… Rand’s villains all appear to be transparently complete morons >.,
[20:15:18] Noumenal Seesaw: has anyone noticed the significance of the title of the chapter?
[20:15:20] Ina Centaur: oh but tory.. boyle did something else…
[20:15:26] Ina Centaur: he managed to mooch a bunch of other smaller companies
[20:15:31] Ina Centaur: all while saying he’s pro laissez faire
[20:15:41] ToryLynn Writer: one of them is the washington man of rearden adn the other is rearden’s friend
[20:15:42] Ina Centaur: and taggart… he has “the power of Washington”
[20:15:49] ToryLynn Writer: that’s true too
[20:16:13] Noumenal Seesaw: the chapter is called “the top and the bottom”
[20:16:18] Dagny Franciosa: /me purrs softly
[20:16:23] ToryLynn Writer: someone mentioned something yesterday about Moochers and Looters.. this group seems to be full of both
[20:16:36] Noumenal Seesaw: it begins with the looters at the top of the skyscraper, but it’s made to sound dark and underground
[20:16:50] ToryLynn Writer: but,.., this it the “Villian’s circle” this tall tower that seems like an underground lair…
[20:16:55] Noumenal Seesaw: it ends in the basemant of the TT building, which is made to seem bright
[20:16:59] Noumenal Seesaw: right
[20:17:08] Noumenal Seesaw: so there’s a moral inversion in this society
[20:17:10] ToryLynn Writer: the heroes all got to thier status by hard work and coming up the line…
[20:17:20] Noumenal Seesaw: the top has become the bottom, and vice versa
[20:18:08] ToryLynn Writer: Which puts… Dan Conway.. in the hero category
[20:18:12] Ina Centaur: exactly, noumenal
[20:18:20] Jordana McMahon: interesting noumenal
[20:18:48] Noumenal Seesaw: a lot of her chapter titles have these interesting double-meanings
[20:18:50] ToryLynn Writer: isn’t that they way it works even in our society.. those at the top are often the most corruptable
[20:19:04] Ina Centaur: yes Dan is a hero, even if he is considered to be “stealing business” from Taggart Transcontinental
[20:19:33] Ina Centaur: the moral inversion is one of the things wrong with Rand’s dystopia
[20:19:48] Grace McDunnough: wrong?
[20:20:01] Brubeck Panacek: (ty everyone, g’nite)
[20:20:02] Noumenal Seesaw: it’s what she’s saying is wrong with the society that’s portrayed
[20:20:11] Noumenal Seesaw: that’s what makes it a dystopia
[20:20:16] Ina Centaur: well, one of the things wrong with the world… one of the things present in her dystopia
[20:20:24] Noumenal Seesaw: right
[20:20:24] Ina Centaur: (nite brubeck)
[20:20:29] Grace McDunnough: Yes, ok .. I misunderstood what you said
[20:20:34] Jordana McMahon: nite brubeck
[20:22:29] Ina Centaur: hmm… yes, tory… so perhaps Rand’s dystopia is still our current world…
[20:22:40] Ina Centaur: btw, it totally alarmed me last year when…. the lights of NY went out
[20:22:50] Ina Centaur: power outage
[20:23:05] Ina Centaur: lol, i thought atlas shrugged was happening ;-P
[20:23:17] Noumenal Seesaw: and that bridge collapse the other day?
[20:23:18] ToryLynn Writer: I haven’t gotten that far!
[20:23:27] Jordana McMahon: even the bridge I was just going to say
[20:23:30] ToryLynn Writer: our society is falling apart…
[20:23:39] Noumenal Seesaw: probably not as bad as in the book…yet
[20:23:43] Jordana McMahon: and soupposedly our infrastructure is rotten
[20:23:44] Ina Centaur: yet…
[20:23:48] Ina Centaur: then again, maybe we are going near a cycle..
[20:24:00] ToryLynn Writer: it’s getting there though.. and I thnk it’s going to get worse before it gets better
[20:24:04] Ina Centaur: and.. atlas shrugged might be the point of downfall… rather than a full-blown ww3
[20:24:16] Jordana McMahon: I think so
[20:24:34] Harman Mayo: i doubt that there will be a ww3
[20:24:39] Ina Centaur: it’s frightening.
[20:24:51] Ina Centaur: oh, either case. whether ww3 or wheter atlas shrugged happens
[20:24:54] Ina Centaur: (hi harman!)
[20:25:09] Harman Mayo: Atlas Shrugged is happening
[20:25:38] Harman Mayo: hi all, sorry for my tardiness
[20:25:42] Noumenal Seesaw: hi
[20:25:45] Harman Mayo: was writing
[20:25:54] Jordana McMahon: hi harman
[20:26:36] Noumenal Seesaw: it’s interesting, the stories of old nat taggart
[20:26:40] ToryLynn Writer: welcome Harman
[20:26:52] Noumenal Seesaw: AR is said to have been influenced by the story of the old railroadman JJ Hill
[20:26:54] Ina Centaur: oh yes, he killed a politician just to see his vision made into reality ;-P
[20:26:55] Harman Mayo: ever read “The Decline And Fall Of The Roman Empire”?
[20:27:05] Seagram Hax: Gibbons?
[20:27:06] Noumenal Seesaw: he build the northern pacific railroad
[20:27:09] Grace McDunnough: Yes Harman
[20:27:11] Seagram Hax: Or is that Mommsen?
[20:27:19] Ina Centaur: oh.. i think i might have read the short version of that, harman…
[20:27:26] Noumenal Seesaw: there’s actually a bridge that JJ Hill built in Minneapolis
[20:27:32] Noumenal Seesaw: (It’s still standing.)
[20:27:34] Harman Mayo: the US has 6 of the 7 signs of an empire in decay
[20:27:52] Seagram Hax: The US is not an empire.
[20:27:53] Seagram Hax: lol
[20:28:01] Ina Centaur: (hi seagram)
[20:28:02] ToryLynn Writer: was the death of JFK really Ceasar at the Senate?
[20:28:08] Seagram Hax: Hi Ina
[20:28:10] Harman Mayo: so Atlas Shrugged is much more true to life than I xcare to admit
[20:28:13] Ina Centaur: and is the US not an empire?
[20:28:22] Noumenal Seesaw: How did the empire topic come up?
[20:28:31] ToryLynn Writer: I think we’re getting very close to becoming an empire
[20:28:38] Ina Centaur: (yes, harman.. it’s prophetic… written over half a century ago)
[20:28:39] ToryLynn Writer: the decline of society, I think
[20:28:56] Noumenal Seesaw: Well, the book doesn’t really deal with foreign policy.
[20:29:08] Noumenal Seesaw: Except for Ragnar, of course.
[20:29:22] ToryLynn Writer: well.. and the San Sebastian
[20:29:27] Noumenal Seesaw: Yes, there’s that
[20:29:37] Harman Mayo: the point isn’t the foriegn policies - it’s the internal consequences
[20:29:41] Noumenal Seesaw: Interesting, by the way, how some of the same kind of nationalization efforts are happening in South America now
[20:29:43] Seagram Hax: You acually names yourself Nouemal?
[20:29:49] Seagram Hax: named
[20:29:52] Noumenal Seesaw: Venezuela, Bolivia, etc.
[20:30:06] ToryLynn Writer: I think that the Mexican government and the San Sebastian could be seen as representative of how the government deals with foreign countries
[20:30:31] Noumenal Seesaw: Oh, and how about this:
[20:30:47] Noumenal Seesaw: When the government of Venezuela threatened new regulations on the oil companies there,
[20:30:50] Noumenal Seesaw: they decided to pull out.
[20:30:55] Noumenal Seesaw: To shrug, as it were.
[20:31:08] Noumenal Seesaw: Just like in the book.
[20:31:26] Ina Centaur: interesting
[20:31:37] Ina Centaur: but, i think that’s a different kind of shrug though.
[20:31:43] Noumenal Seesaw: probably
[20:31:44] Ina Centaur: not like what Francisco does to his mines later ;-P
[20:31:51] Noumenal Seesaw: more pragamtic, less principled
[20:31:58] Ina Centaur: lol pragmatic
[20:32:15] Ina Centaur: easier, i guess. less flamboyant ;-P
[20:32:16] Noumenal Seesaw: yeah, nobody’s been blowing up any mines lately
[20:32:24] Noumenal Seesaw: though the copper workers are actually on strike in Chile right now
[20:32:42] Noumenal Seesaw: that’s why copper is so expensive, and people keep stealing scrap
[20:33:45] ToryLynn Writer: /me sighs
[20:33:45] Ina Centaur: yes..
[20:33:57] Ina Centaur: history reoccurs.. you wonder whether it’s conspiracy theory ;-P
[20:34:04] ToryLynn Writer: so, this society we’re seeing in AS… could very well become our society
[20:34:14] Ina Centaur: kinda like how if Hillary becomes president, you’d have a clinton or bush in the whitehouse for the last 2 decades
[20:34:25] Ina Centaur: as if.. someone were masterminding it all
[20:34:29] Seagram Hax: Then maybe Hillary shouldn’t be President.
[20:34:29] Noumenal Seesaw: hillary clinton used to like Ayn Rand, surprisingly
[20:34:31] Grace McDunnough: The society in AS is very much our society
[20:34:32] Noumenal Seesaw: when she was a kid
[20:34:32] Harman Mayo: next we’ll be discussing the Illuminati - lol
[20:34:37] Ina Centaur: that “history” doesn’t occur by will of *the people* … but by some master storyteller who’s run out of stories
[20:34:42] Seagram Hax: Hillary Clinton says she likes everything.
[20:34:43] Ina Centaur: and has to repeat the same subplots over and over ..
[20:34:53] Seagram Hax: She’d say she like raping babies if it polled well.
[20:34:59] Noumenal Seesaw: well…
[20:35:08] ToryLynn Writer: well.. the guys in thier little ivory tower did seem very.. Masonic
[20:35:09] Noumenal Seesaw: wouldn’t play well with her key demographic
[20:35:17] Kiz Flanagan: Raping babies polls pretty well in some places
[20:35:31] Ina Centaur: (hi kiz)
[20:35:37] Kiz Flanagan: (hi ina)
[20:35:38] Harman Mayo: We masons aren’t a threat
[20:35:41] Seagram Hax: True, which is why she should run for chieftess of Papua New Guinea.
[20:35:45] Ina Centaur: ok, guys, let’s try to keep our discussion on Atlas SHrugged instead of Hillary…
[20:35:49] Ina Centaur: (sorry i brought her up..)
[20:35:51] Noumenal Seesaw: yeah
[20:36:06] Seagram Hax: Isn’t she exactly like that Roark guy?
[20:36:14] Seagram Hax: Or is that The Fountainhead?
[20:36:18] Noumenal Seesaw: who, dagny?
[20:36:18] Grace McDunnough: Roark .. um .. wong book
[20:36:22] Seagram Hax: lol
[20:36:22] Grace McDunnough: *wrong
[20:36:23] ToryLynn Writer: heheh
[20:36:28] Ina Centaur: (but if y’all are interested… you’re free to hold your own discussion on Hillary, et al, politics, etc… this sim is open for people to book events and such on)
[20:36:39] ToryLynn Writer: Aaaanyway
[20:36:45] Ina Centaur: (http://calendar.sliterary.com … to book!)
[20:36:59] Ina Centaur: seagram, same author, wrong book ;-P
[20:37:00] ToryLynn Writer: so, the guy at the end of the chapter…
[20:37:07] Seagram Hax: No, I know…
[20:37:08] Noumenal Seesaw: careful….
[20:37:24] ToryLynn Writer: Does he work for Taggart.. or against them?
[20:37:25] Ina Centaur: yes, the mystery guy Eddie was talking to…
[20:37:32] Ina Centaur: it’s interesting how Eddie just tells him *everything*
[20:37:32] Noumenal Seesaw: i guess it’s a mystery!
[20:37:55] ToryLynn Writer: I wish we would have gotten to see him say something
[20:38:17] Grace McDunnough: He is rather inquisitive
[20:38:32] ToryLynn Writer: but.. that bit was about…. the fact that Eddie Willers has a big mouth
[20:38:50] Ina Centaur: lol
[20:39:01] Ina Centaur: i think eddie just had a lot to spill
[20:39:16] Ina Centaur: or then again… you might wonder why Eddie would choose to say all that to the guy in the cafeteria
[20:39:26] ToryLynn Writer: he does.. but.. he doesn’t know who he’s realy talking to
[20:39:27] Ina Centaur: why doesn’t he just spill on the broken typewriter guy
[20:39:56] ToryLynn Writer: because Broken typewriter guy seems to be sort of a waste.. has no ambition.. and probably doesn’t care a lot
[20:40:16] ToryLynn Writer: it sounds like mystery guy REALLY cares.. and asks a lot of questions
[20:40:25] Ina Centaur: lol
[20:40:25] Harman Mayo: and also doesn’t pry
[20:40:35] Ina Centaur: oh harman, he pries.. he asks about what Dagny does
[20:40:43] ToryLynn Writer: the last question “Which records?” seemed sort of.. creepy stalkerish
[20:40:49] Harman Mayo: not him - typewriter guy
[20:41:01] ToryLynn Writer: yeah. typewriter guy keeps to himself.. complete lack of prying
[20:41:20] Harman Mayo: our cafeteria friend is very prying
[20:41:29] Harman Mayo: prompts at all the right places
[20:41:32] ToryLynn Writer: I’m surprised he didn’t ask what type of shampoo she used
[20:41:50] Grace McDunnough: “I’m gonna wash that man right out of my hair … ”
[20:41:57] Grace McDunnough: Sorry, could not resist
[20:42:03] ToryLynn Writer: hehehe
[20:42:05] Ina Centaur: haaa
[20:42:25] ToryLynn Writer: if you go through the ellipses.. you can almost fill in the questions that were missing
[20:42:32] Ina Centaur: well, it’s interesting that Halley’s name is mentioned again
[20:42:40] Harman Mayo: a very sinister character, since we never actually meet him - only hear Eddie’s responses
[20:42:59] Ina Centaur: oh yes, tory. the ellipses… it’s an interesting way to portray a convo
[20:43:00] Noumenal Seesaw: but eddie likes his face
[20:43:01] ToryLynn Writer: I wonder what Halley’s music would sound like… in an era of discordant, shapeless music
[20:43:08] Noumenal Seesaw: he’s not that sinister
[20:43:44] Jordana McMahon: nomenal have you read the whole book
[20:43:46] Ina Centaur: yes, and we know that eddie knows the difference between ugly Randian villain faces and good guy beautiful faces ;-P
[20:43:50] ToryLynn Writer: well.. if you haven’t gotten to the next chapter… I won’t spoil it.. but..
[20:43:51] Noumenal Seesaw: yeah